WingColors

Maybe I'm alone in this, but I always go with my gut. Unless I'm forced for some reason, I never deal with people I even remotely distrust. It may sound overly philosophical, but trust is the most important thing we have in this world. If you can't trust someone, whether it be your friends, family, girlfriend, boyfriend, etc. they aren't worth your time.

I'm with bgilham on this. I don't deal with people I can't trust and tend to go with my gut.

That said...

If I have to deal with people I don't trust (for one reason or another) and if I believe they are lying, I'll approach the situation by asking if they could clarify the point. If I have evidence they're lying, I would give the contradictory evidence. For example:

Person A: "Samantha said she hadn't had a chance to work on the reports last night."

Me: "When did she say that? I spoke to Samantha this morning and she said they were done."

Person A: "Well, err, I could just have mistaken... let me check."

If it was a lie, I just called them out on it, without calling them out on it. It could have been a misunderstanding, but if it wasn't, and the person wouldn't retract their statement, and you had evidence to prove the person was lying, then out them out right there. "Alright, you're lying about this."

My wife's aunt is a pathological liar. She lies about things that never would matter, and does it constantly. I can't even fathom it. I've gotten to just not take anything she says seriously. She's a nice person, but she lives in a different reality than we do.

If it's something important, call them on it. If it's someone you have to deal with on a regular basis you can either confront them, or just limit your relationship to a perfunctory/non reliance level.

Either way it'll be impossible to respect them the same.

yeah, I would try to call it out. In the end, it may turn out you're wrong, in which case you own up and apologize!

I really am not cheating on you!!

Hehe, ok, in all seriousness, while I commend your giving the benefit of the doubt, instinct isn't something to push aside. If you think someone is lying to you, find a non-threatening way to approach him/her and ask for some clarification. Don't accuse. Most liars, unless pathological, are rarely able to weave perfect webs of deceit. If they have to reexplain a lie, they'll probably get tripped up in the details, and then you'll know.

What about when someone has over 150 sick hours and calls in sick to work but actually goes to the beach? Is that unforgivable too?

I will always pick confrontation over shying away if the lie relates to an important matter. I was referring more to the smaller lies people tell. Like "yeah, 800 people are subscribed to my feed" or, "fuck yeah I nailed that". You might be sure they're lying, but really, what difference does it make?

Good example, Lila. I am one of those people who call in sick to work when I am healthy. Please realize this does not impact on any one else's workload and I plan it out carefully so there's nothing vital I'm compromising. I never question when others do the same. This thread, though, was about what to do if you think someone is telling lies, with or without facts. I guess it highly depends, for me, on who (how much power and authority) telling lies, what their motivation is and what impact it has on me. For instance, if I sense or know as factual that my federal government is lying - compared to my husband lying about his committment to us- compared to colleauges lying about the quality of my work / endangering my professional reputation.

Good question Rich. I think if the possible lie was minor, and it had absolutely no knock-on effect on myself or anyone else I care about, I would probably just ignore it. It isn't worth my time or energy to try and call them on it when I have nothing to gain or lose from it. However, I would make a mental note to treat what that person says in the future with doubt. I wouldn't trust them, and that is something a lot of people here (myself included) regard very highly.

White lies are alright. But usually I'd try to catch them in a lie by referring to the lie a lot and getting them to repeat it over and over again. For the most part, if they are unskilled, I'd always catch them goofing up.

If I know that they are lying, I'll call their bluff with the facts that i have.

There is only one kind of liar that I can't catch. People that lie with their eyes. Those that can look you straight in the eye and project the exact feeling they want you to think they are. I know something is not right, but all the body language says they are right.

The sad thing is...it takes one to know one. I wonder if that makes me a bad person.

But as a general rule though, I don't deal people that frequently lie to seem bigger than they are. That's just something that's not worth.

The sad thing is...it takes one to know one. I wonder if that makes me a bad person.

I hadn't considered that angle before, but you're right. When I was younger, I considered myself a fairly adept liar. Now I mostly detest people who lie. It's all come full circle, I suppose.

I gave this a lot of thought but no one seemed to have brought the reason why someone is lying. Added with the lie itself, it doesn't necessarily make us "bad" people.

Fellas, when you girlfriend asks how she looks in an outfit your automatically say she looks good or (if you don't like it) say you don't? We all know with some personality types that is inviting a war. When the cop says you're speeding, how many people lied and played like they didn't realize they were? People at work surfing the internet when they are supposed to be working. The boss comes around, looks like he/she is heading for you and you close the browser. That's an implied lie - you were doing something you weren't supposed to be doing and tried to hide it. That's what a lie does.

So are you bad people? What about the person that lies because they are insecure, vunerable, afraid? Because Scrivs brought this up on a ST once, Scrivs lied to me about something. Soon I figured out he was lying and I kept dropping hints I knew - he still wouldn't admit it. Eventually I couldn't stand it anymore and confronted him about it. He admitted it and I could feel the "here it comes" but the thing was, I understood why instinctually he felt the need to protect himself and realized I hadn't done my job right in letting him know that he could come to me about that particular issue. Getting through that made our foundation strong as acid. I have absolutely no regrets because I know that situation will never come up again and Scrivs and I laugh at it now. Scrivs, Mike and I are very close. We started off as strangers - now we're family.

I don't like liars - my father was a master who would look you dead in the eye and it was like he believed what he was saying. I learned early how to spot them. But I realize that people usually lie for a reason and I try find out what that reason is before passing judgment.

I don't think understanding the motivitation behind a lie excuses it in any way.

I do agree that many lies really don't matter. But the thing is, from my perspective, it still cheapens things. In the above example with the guy talking about how many subscribers he had, or what he's nailed. He's trying to boost his appearance in a very immature way, and really that will only work on other immature people. If someone's saying things like that for reasons other than humor, I'm going to lose respect for them, no exceptions. It may not be much, but it's still something. It can also be earned back of course, but it can in no way help communication or improve a relationship.

I agree, lying about the number of subscribers is not smart. Personally, when people throw numbers around, back it up. Lying about the number of subscribers isn't the "lied to you" lie I was talking about.

I was referring more to the black and white view of ejecting someone that lies because most people tell some sort of lie everyday but some seem "okay" and others not. *shrugs

Well not everyone can handle the truth.

The question is always where we draw the line, not all lies are justified and for many of us, we can't always understand why someone did it, especially when the realization dawned on us that they have been lying.

Let's take this question further.

If your partner (in a relationship) lied to make you happy when you're sad. Is that acceptable? Even if it's a big lie?

If your partner (in a relationship) lied to make you happy when you're sad. Is that acceptable? Even if it's a big lie?

There's just too many variables to consider. Is she making me happy by lying about cheating on me? I don't mind the "do I look fat in this?"-esque white lies, but even those sting a little when the truth is discovered. There's a difference between lying and being tactful and I suppose I strive for a partner who values being tactful and truthful over making someone happy and lying.

I agree, lying about the number of subscribers is not smart.

That really depends on how many subscribers you've got. I think it's much the same as starting a new forum... People have freely admitted to seeding conversations with multiple accounts. Saying you've got twice as many subscribers as you really have when you only have a very low number could be seen as a method to seem popular.

I don't see how that lie counts against you especially as it doesn't hurt anybody (unless you're using it to inflate your feed advertising fee, etc) and nobody can prove you otherwise.

I'm not saying I do this, but it's easy to see why people would and the same goes for all website statistics.

As you were hinting the reason for lying about that kind of stuff is to not seem unpopular. Nobody likes that they've only got 3 subscribers on their RSS feeds or only get 20 unique visitors a day and it's that insecurity of popularity that makes people feel if they tell the truth, nobody will bother to come and see their site.

The logic is sound... why would somebody read a site that has 3 subscribers vs a site that has 200 or 4000? The number hints at the quality and very often that's far from the truth in itself.

We're veering off topic, but I really don't ever consider how many subscribers a site has. Who cares? It's the content that makes me read a site or not.

Back on. It's tough on the partner thing. I'm the type of person who would prefer honesty always in that regard. White lies create a false perception, maybe someone doesn't know that those pants make them look fat! Encouraging them to wear them anyway could build a false body image which could continue to effect them for years. Yeah it's kind of a silly example, but it's true.

Instead of lying sometimes it is better to say nothing at all than lie, particularly on something like stats. If a site has a small number of visitors Alexa, Compete, Technorati, Google, etc. will show the pattern of that. Hence, that's a stupid lie: easy to be busted.

Ozone42: I admit, with my friends I have a policy: don't ask me a question you can't handle the answer to. When my friend Yo asks me if something makes her butt look bigger I tell her yes, because it is. Some people can't handle that honesty though. Sort of like the guy asking me "Do you love me?" - does the man really want to know?

I think we all want completely honest but I know very few people who can handle it.

There bgilham hit it. It's not just about what you say, it's about how you say it as well. We often forget that people are human being as well, as much as they want to hear it, it's hard for people to swallow the absolute truth. It's also hard to put some absolute truths tactfully.

"You're an ass" for instance is hard to put it politely without missing the point entirely.

Yet some truths I find can be told nicely given a certain amount of empathy. Like from a friend to another saying that their life is in a mess. Or a loved one to another that they need to buck up on things. You don't have to drop the ball on them...just lower it gently. It'll still be down, but they'll have time to take it in.

I think it's the shock of the truth that gets to people more than the truth itself. Shock and maybe expectations of wanting people to say otherwise.

We are all guilty of lying at one point or another. For some it is easier to lie than tell the truth. People lie for many reasons. fear of judgment, trying to look good to others, fear of hurting someones feelings, for ones own advantage, lying to protect oneself etc etc. Without knowing what it is that you read, it is hard to advice you what to do. I would look at the situation and the outcome and consider why this person may of lied and then go from there.

I read something over the weekend that I figured was a lie. Do I care enough to confront them? No, as long as they don't bring it up to me. If they are unwise enough to do that...it's on. :)

I tend to overlook it if it's a one-time thing--like Rich said, if there's any doubt, I too, rarely contest it. But once there's a pattern and you're in a relationship of trust with this person, then that becomes a liability.

As Michael of The Office said, "Fool me once, strike one. But fool me twice ... strike three."